trying to get a census for a certain street

Justjan · Post by **Justjan** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 5:10 pm

yes i am sure they werent , no marriage was ever found , just the way its been worded , odd i am getting Frances as being born in 1864 -18th april ,
and the way its looking to me they were married 1861 in Glasow 17 th March , so is the other child maybe not Elizabeths , me thinks we are going crazy ,

sorry i dont know how to upload the certs i have tried

Justjan · Post by **Justjan** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 7:19 pm

annette
i have read and re read this , but cant see anything that says Agnes McPherson ? expect in what you have written , i cant see any ref to her ,
and where this Cecilia came from is anyones guess , i only ever seen Frances and James on the Census
my this has lost me big time

Post by **SarahND** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 7:34 pm

nelmit wrote:Pauper now admits that he was never married to Agnes McPherson the mother of the above named children but merely cohabits with her. His neighbours verify he has stayed there for 10 years.

Regards,
Sarah

Justjan · Post by **Justjan** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 7:42 pm

yes i seen that , but who brought her name into it ? i cant see anything that says anything about her other than that ,
as only Frances ( Gran) Charles ( Dad) Eliz (Mother) and 2 children show up

nelmit · Post by **nelmit** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:18 pm

Justjan wrote:annette
i have read and re read this , but cant see anything that says Agnes McPherson ? expect in what you have written , i cant see any ref to her ,
and where this Cecilia came from is anyones guess , i only ever seen Frances and James on the Census
my this has lost me big time

From Charles's poorhouse application -

Pauper now admits that he was never married to Agnes McPherson the mother of the above named children but merely cohabits with her. His neighbours verify he has stayed there for 10 years.

I'll try to sum it up the way I see it.

You started off by telling us that on your grandfather's marriage certificate he said his parents were Charles Stewart and Agnes McPherson. Then he discovered that his mother was really Elizabeth Cameron when he saw his birth certificate. Indeed that was entered on his death certificate by a relative who obviously had been told about his birth as she even gave his correct age. You were also told he was orphaned and put in to the Poorhouse.

The birth in 1867 at 73 King Street seemed right - a boy called James to an Elizabeth Cameron but we needed more proof than that.
Then we discovered that she lived with a Charles Stewart who your grandfather stated was his father's name. Getting better.
This boy was orphaned and put in to the Poorhouse. Another fact that ties in with your grandfather's story.
At the time of his death this Charles Stewart was living with a lady called Agnes McPherson who he claimed was the mother of his children. The same name as the lady who your grandfather gives as his mother. Absolutely conclusive as far as I'm concerned!!!!

So...............................James grew up believing that Charles Stewart and Agnes McPherson were his parents from the information given at the time of his placement at the Poorhouse which is why he said so on his marriage entry.

I don't see how I can make it any clearer than that. Don't ponder on the wee discrepencies like Fanny/Cecilia. She was born Fanny and we know she was the girl who was put in to the Poorhouse with James because of the reference to her being employed by the Johnstons and there she was in 1881.

Believe me I've seen a lot worse than this and remember we have the benefit of access to facts that your grandfather never had.

I really hope I've convinced you now as I don't see what more I can do.

Regards,
Annette

Justjan · Post by **Justjan** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 8:43 pm

At the time of his death this Charles Stewart was living with a lady called Agnes McPherson who he claimed was the mother of his children. The same name as the lady who your grandfather gives as his mother. Absolutely conclusive as far as I'm

Justjan · Post by **Justjan** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:21 pm

sorry Annette
i am the middle man so to speak , and i have to keep comming back and forth ,
i know these sound daft questions , but my Brother is asking me ,
what would have happened to James between his Father dying and the November date ,? do you think maybe Agnes has kept him there ? just wondering where in all this the people who adopted him were /are , i expect we should get that off the Records at the Mitchell , can you tell me
will they post them out if i give them these details i now have ,
as its June before my Brother can get up from England , and me getting away for the day is impossible , also i would get lost asi have no sense of direction ,

thanks loads for all this help , as really weeks ago i rules these ones out as we didnt believe James did have a Sister , and really this is the first we have heard of her , and so unlike us not to have known as we had a lot of storys about things , but again , he hasnt actually lived long with her i expect , i am going to try SP to find if i can find any of these little children who died young and hopefully find one with a Frances somewhere in her name , try and convince the others we are at the end -yawnnnnnnnnn

nelmit · Post by **nelmit** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:27 pm

Justjan wrote:sorry Annette

what would have happened to James between his Father dying and the November date ,?

He would have lived at The Poorhouse I think.

Justjan · Post by **Justjan** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 9:43 pm

oh i see , i just wondered at the dates , i will try email them tonight
and see what they say now i have dobs , as she did say it was a long search without ,
i am still trying to get parson street on these census and no luck , i have thousands it wont let me narrow it down to the Street its self

Justjan · Post by **Justjan** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 12:57 am

phew , i cant seem to get a marriage for Eliz Cs parents , i have everyother name but no Frances ,
looking at her death cert i cant make out if shes been a Cameron who has married a Cameron ,

shes down as Frances Cameron widow of John Cameron quay labourer ,
died 11th July 1871 ( odd James Stewart died on 11th July as well)
her parents are ---------- Cameron cotton spinner , and Frances Cameron m/s McGill ,
and she died at king street , and as for Charles Parents , they havent married either , makes it hard to do much more

TalkingScot.com

trying to get a census for a certain street

this is the bit , i cant see where he has said that

re Frances Cameron