James Daugherty, Irish ex-Soldier, Discharged in 1816

Rockford · Post by **Rockford** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:42 pm

Hi everyone,

I'm looking for some advice before I go haring off on my own, given that I don't know much about what is available for Ireland around this time. The story is this (and apologies in advance for the length!):

I have a Peter Milligan and Elizabeth Docherty living in Brewsterford, Holytown in Lanarkshire at the 1841 census, both born in Ireland. On Elizabeth’s death in 1878 her parents are given as James Docherty, Private in the Royal Scots Fusiliers and Isobel Grear, both deceased. Elizabeth’s age at her death, would have her born around 1818.

From a recent contact, I have been given notes showing that In 1841, there is a James Dogherty, Pensioner, and wife Isobel also living in Brewsterford, very near to Peter and Elizabeth. Again both James and Isobel are born Ireland. James is listed as 89 and Isobel in her late sixties. I can find no trace of either James or Isobel in 1851 or thereafter.

This could be a huge coincidence, however, given that ‘pensioner’, at that time would (I believe) indicate army service, I set off on the trail of any record of a James Daugherty serving as a private with the Royal Scots Fusiliers, based on the information from Elizabeth’s death certificate. After a few false starts, I found out that the RSF were known as the 21st Regiment of Foot and a search on the National Archives website turned up discharge papers for the 21st from the late 1700s/early 1800s.

Looking for any James’ serving with the 21st Regt [using first name only due to variations of Docherty], turned up one – James Daugherty, born Klenchar in County Down, who was discharged in 1816 aged 46.

I received the copies of the documents from the NA yesterday and the birthplace of Klenchar is actually Killinchy. This James served with the Lochaber Fencibles, the 21st, and two Royal Veterans’ Battalions – giving a total of 17 years service. The Lochaber Fencibles, although shortlived, were apparently in Ireland at the time James joined up.

His discharge papers state that the 4th Royal Veterans’ Battalion in which James was serving in 1816 was being disbanded and he was ‘desirous’ of being discharged due to weak eyes as a result of opthalmia, caused by service in Egypt [with the 21st Regt. in 1807].

James had requested to stay in Canada until the discharge was processed, but was ordered to stay in Kingston [I’m assuming this is Jamaica as his regiments did serve in both Canada and the West Indies].

All of this gives me two problems……

1. If James was in Kingston in late 1816 [or even in Canada], could he be back in Ireland by c.1818 to have fathered Elizabeth?

2. If he was ‘aged about 46’ and his discharge in 1816, he would only have been in his early/mid seventies at the 1841 census, not 89.

I could [just about] live with the age discrepancies, given the vagaries of the 1841 census and the approximation of his age given by the army, but he must have got back to Ireland pretty quickly if indeed he is Elizabeth’s father.

Does anyone have any comments on my efforts so far, or where I could go to take this further to prove whether the James Daugherty discharged in 1841 is the father of Elizabeth? James was my 5 x great grandfather and has been a brick wall of monumental proportions!

Best wishes

Brian

Currie · Post by **Currie** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 3:22 pm

Hello Brian,

There are some articles in the London Times concerning the wreck of the “Harpooner” which was returning detachments of the 4th Royal Veterans from Canada. For access go down this road, it still seems to work. viewtopic.php?t=11928&highlight=tryinfomarks

A search for Harpooner will bring up lengthy articles on 18th and 23rd December. A search for “4th Royal Veteran” will bring up articles on the 13th December and 4th January. There are lists of lost and saved.

Accounts in book form here. http://books.google.com.au/books?um=1&a ... arch+Books

There’s a bit more here. http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/ ... 81607.html

I’m not sure whether he’s there but maybe there’s a clue buried in there somewhere. If not it makes interesting reading, in particular the book.

All the best,
Alan

Post by **SarahND** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:10 am

Hi Alan,
Any hints as to how to get current access to the 19th century British newspaper archive? I have just found an article about my ggg grandfather that makes reference to notices in the Belfast Newsletter (ones that didn't come up when I searched myself, so OCR must not be reading it correctly).

Sorry Brian, to hijack your post

Sarah

Currie · Post by **Currie** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 4:30 am

Hello Sarah,

I don’t know of any current freebies. I was hoping that Gale would come up with something for National library Week (or Month) but I haven’t seen any.

However, I’d be only too pleased to check that for you. The Belfast News-Letter coverage is from 1828 (16,668 issues) and I can’t see any missing years. If you post the details, or send them to me, I’ll see what I can find.

All the best,
Alan

Rockford · Post by **Rockford** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 12:51 pm

Hi Alan,

It never ceases to amaze what you dig up - I'm off to have a look now.

Sarah, don't worry about hijacking the post. For the help you've given me in the past, I'll allow it just this once

. I hope you find your relation in Belfast.

I'll keep you updated.

Best wishes

Brian

Post by **joette** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 3:27 pm

is it possible that wife was with him on active service?I think it was fairly common for wives to follow their husbands into active service.I know during the Crimean War at the least that some wives went-they were selected at random & had little warning of their departure.It was not only Florence Nightingale nursing the troops-many wives did too & they cooked,cleaned & washed clothes into the bargain.
Perhaps she was a hardy army wife-following her man around the World.Happy to return to Ireland to give birth to her daughter-or is it possible she was christened there but born overseas?

Post by **SarahND** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 3:51 pm

Thanks for the offer, Alan. I see that the problem is that the coverage of the Belfast News-Letter only begins in 1828. The references in the article are all from issues in 1820-26

Looks like a trip to Belfast is in order...

Now I'd better quickly sign off, since Brian said he would only allow me to hijack his post just the once

Regards,
Sarah

Rockford · Post by **Rockford** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 5:01 pm

SarahND wrote:Now I'd better quickly sign off, since Brian said he would only allow me to hijack his post just the once Sarah

Caught ye.. Honestly, see some folk...

Hi Joette,

It's certainly possible that his wife was with him - I know that I've seen programmes up to (I think) the Crimean War where wives were with the camp - might also have been Rory Bremner's episode of WDYTYA as I seem to remember that his ancestor had been an army doctor delivering camp babies

The articles Alan mentioned do refer to soldiers and their wives, although this seems to be more for officers than men in this case.

The issue I have is that there are two pieces of information - James' discharge papers and the 1841 Holytown census and it's difficult to tie them up, although I know that I'm lucky to have these possible [and tantalising] connections. Unfortunately I haven't forayed much into Irish records, due to the spelling variations involved and not having much else to go on.

What is positive is that in the links Alan posted containing details of the victims of the sinking, neither James nor any other Daugherty/Docherty variations are listed.

I haven't had any luck locating them on on the census beyond 1841, or either an OPR or statutory death record, but I'll keep chipping away at and digging for whatever snippets I can find!

Best wishes

Brian

Post by **joette** » Tue Apr 21, 2009 10:08 pm

Brian I have many of those too.So frustrating.

Currie · Post by **Currie** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 9:47 am

Sarah,

The Dublin newspaper, Freeman’s Journal, has issues for 1820 and 1821 then there’s a big gap to 1830. If it’s something that may have been reported in Dublin in those two years I could check that newspaper if you like.

But reading the blurb, “Until the late 1830s the Journal was a mouthpiece of rule from London, receiving subsidies for the publication of proclamations and containing very little Irish news,” maybe the chances would be slim.

Some of the gaps in the 19C newspapers are really strange e.g. single years with no issues whereas many years either side appear to be complete.

All the best,
Alan