Thomas Caldwell and Margaret Barbour

[frances]

A friend has been researching the above couple for a number of years. She has managed quite successfully to trace Thomas but has hit a brick wall with Margaret.

Thomas Caldwell (watch maker and latterly a jeweler ) married Margaret Balfour on the 10th January 1876 at Waterside Reformed Presbyterian Church , Londonderry.Margaret was aged 21, her birth would have been C 1855. Her father was given as Joseph Barbour (grocer)

Margaret and Thomas had 6 children. Joseph (died in infancy) Margaret, Thomas (died in infancy) Mary, William and Harriette.

In the 1901 and 1911 census Thomas is recorded as being married, there is no sign of Margaret.

Thomas died on the 7th December 1934 and is buried in Belfast City Cemetery.On his DC he is described as a widower.

The BIG QUESTION is what happened to Margaret ?

There are two stories in the family, one that Margaret died shortly after the birth of William in 1881.Secondly there was a legal? separation between Thomas and Margaret and that she emigrated with other family members. Neither of these can be confirmed.

As you can see my friend has done a remarkable amount of work in gathering the information-- If anyone can help in finding out what happened to Margaret would help complete some of the story.

Hopefully someone out there can help/give advice of where to go next. Finding Margaret would be wonderful for the family.

Many thanks for reading this.

Frances

[SarahND]

Hello Frances,
Some questions to help the search for those of us who don't know the family:

I assume your friend has traced the living children to see if their mother ever shows up with them? Did any of them leave Ireland?

Which of the children died between 1901 and 1911? Thomas says he only has 3 children living in 1911 although there were 4 with him in 1901. By 1911 only the eldest daughter is still at home.

Was Margaret born in Ireland or Scotland? I see in the 1911 census that Thomas was born in Kilmarnock, Scotland.

William was age 9 in 1901, so there appears to have been a slip of the finger when you typed his year of birth as 1881. So she went missing some time between 1891 and 1901.

A last thought is that she may have been in a mental institution or other hospital and the names of the patients were not given in full on the census form. There are a number of people enumerated as "M C" who might fit the bill if we knew her birthplace to narrow it down.

All the best,
Sarah

[Currie]

Hello Frances & Sarah,

There's no mention of a former spouse in his obituary. Three daughters survived him, I guess William died.

Sunday Independent, Sunday, December 09, 1934.
“Mr. Thomas Caldwell (80), who died at Florenceville Ave., Belfast, was a native of Scotland, but had been resident in Ulster for nearly 50 years. He was a former director of Sharman D. Neill, and was a noted rifle shot, having figured on the Scottish team at Bisley for many years. He had a wonderful collection of trophies won in open tournaments, including the Elcho Shield replicas. Three married daughters survive him.”

Irish Independent, Monday, December 10, 1934.
“Mr. Thomas Caldwell (80), who died at Florenceville Ave., Belfast, was a native of Scotland, but was for 50 years resident in Belfast. He was a former director of Sharman D. Neill, and was best known as a noted rifle shot. For many years he was one of the Scottish eights at Bisley, and on several occasions was a member of the team which won the Elcho Shield. He was a member of the National and the Ulster Rifle Associations.”

From as early as 1881 there are many newspaper listings of shooting results in which he is mentioned.

Sharman D Neill.
http://www.925-1000.com/forum/viewtopic ... 350#p73985

All the best,
Alan

[Elwyn 1]

If you haven’t already got it, PRONI in Belfast have a probate file which should contain Thomas’s will. Here’s the abstract. (The will itself is not on-line and so you would need to get a copy from PRONI).

Caldwell Thomas of 19 Florenceville Avenue Belfast gentleman died 7 December 1934 Probate Belfast 9 May to Margaret Caldwell spinster. Effects £1347 7s.

I wonder who that Margaret is, given that the newspaper report says all his 3 surviving daughters were married. Perhaps they got that wrong? (Her relationship and address should be evident from the probate file).

I searched for Margaret Balfour deaths, anywhere in Ireland, 1891 – 1901 but there aren’t any of an age to be your Margaret.

Thomas seems to have been a respected member of the community. I rather feel that if he gave his marital status as married in 1901 & 1911, he was probably telling the truth, so I’d suspect his wife was still alive (as far as he was aware).

I’d try and track the other children and see if Margaret was with them. Do you know where they ended up?

[frances]

Thank you all for your replies. I will get in touch with my friend to clarify some points and post again with more information.

As I previously said she has been searching for Margaret for such a long time it would be wonderful if she could be found.

Many thanks

Frances

[frances]

Not much more to add.

Friend states that the beneficiary of Thomas's will was his unmarried daughter Margaret, although she had subsequently had a child (Violet born 1922)

Son William died in 1911 of TB aged 19.

I have looked at scotlandspeople for a birth of Margaret Barbour , still can't find a record with a father Joseph that fits the bill !!!

The witness at Thomas and Margaret's wedding was an Elizabeth Barbour -a sister of Margaret perhaps.

Sarah I would be interested in looking at mental institute /hospital records could you give me the link to this please ?

Any more help or advice would be great.

Thank you all for your efforts so far-- much appreciated

Frances

[WilmaM]

Was William's mother mentioned on his death cert in 1911?

I took a look at the Ireland census for 1901: http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/
putting in C & M and an approx. age brought up over 100 females in various places around the province.
Clicking through to the actual record gives a lot more information
Age, religion, occupation, marital status, birth place plus length of illness.
All still only identified by initials [only space on those returns for that]
So still a needle in a haystack really.

[SarahND]

Yes, I only did the same thing as Wilma just explained, putting the initials in the boxes. I don't have any other source for the institutional records. If you only look at those who were listed as married and in the general correct age bracket, it brings the number down considerably, but a birthplace would really help one feel more confident about the choice. If it luckily ended up being an institution that has existing records, there is always the chance that you could find them.

Best wishes,
Sarah

[nelmit]

If you can find addresses for institutes in 1911 then the easiest way to search for her is by years of marriage and children.

I had a wee quick look at this one looking at each page down the marriage column but couldn't find a match.

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/p ... ad/182598/

The females are on the first 17 pages (scroll right down to the bottom of the index).

There is also a death of a Joseph Barber, shopkeeper in Londonderry in 1885 - I wonder if he is worth investigating.

Regards,
Annette

[Elwyn 1]

Yes, I only did the same thing as Wilma just explained, putting the initials in the boxes. I don't have any other source for the institutional records. If you only look at those who were listed as married and in the general correct age bracket, it brings the number down considerably, but a birthplace would really help one feel more confident about the choice. If it luckily ended up being an institution that has existing records, there is always the chance that you could find them.

Best wishes,
Sarah

Most hospital and institutional records for what is now Northern Ireland have been sent to PRONI (the public record office) in Belfast. So if you narrow the search to a specific institution that’s where to look for the records.

Be aware that there is a 100 year closure rule on these types of records, for privacy reasons, so any for 1914 onwards are not openly available. Family can make a Freedom of Information request (which is often granted) but what you will usually get is extracted and redacted information, rather than free access to the original records.