Where did all the Foulners go?

[parrot1974]

Hope someone can help with ideas of where to look for the origins of the Foulner family of Glasgow, Lanarkshire. I've traced them back as far as c. 1786, with John Foulner a stocking manufacturer in Glasgow, but have no idea where to look for further info. I've tried Scotland's People, but nothing pre-19th Century and the same goes for FamilySearch.org and www.ancestry.co.uk. So, does anyone know anything about this, or have any ideas where I can start looking?

[emanday]

Hi Parrot1974,

A warm welcome to TS.

Can you give us an idea of what you already know about John Foulner. Wife's name, marriage and have you identified any of their children?

[parrot1974]

Hi Mary and thanks for the welcome.
I haven't got a great deal of information, but here goes:
John Foulner (c.1786) lived in Glasgow, Lanarkshire, was a stocking manufacturer. Since I can't find a record of his birth I can't be sure. He married Jean Neil and they then had 3 sons:
John Neil Foulner - c.1819, became a cork cutter m. Ann Bond of Worcestershire, stayed in Glasgow and had 6 children.
James Foulner - c.1819 (maybe twins?), was a cork manufacturer in Barony, employing 7 men and 2 boys, married Mary Abbey of Hull, had 6 children and died in Glasgow, 1873.
William Foulner - c.1823 married Jane Cook and emigrated to New Zealand.
I have no real info on John and nothing at all on his wife. Any ideas very much welcomed.

[SarahND]

Hi and welcome
Did you get the information about John and his occupation from his children's marriage certificates? Censuses? Just wondering what you've checked so far.
All the best,
Sarah

[emanday]

I had hoped that John and/or Jean might have survived to 1855 and had death certificates, but I'm getting nothing on SP.

Unfortunately, once you get back to those dates, you are totally dependant on the OPR's and they can often be a bit uninformative.

Have you looked to see if there are any wills or testaments for the family? I found a rellie I never knew about on someone's will, so it might be worth a look.

[Russell]

Hi

I'm interested that two of his sons married English girls and it made me wonder if their father John was originally English. Mechanised stocking manufacture started south of the border and it would have been a potentially profitable enterprise to start up a business where there was good trading opportunities and a plentiful supply of quality yarn - cotton and linen.

Russell

[Russell]

Hi again Parrot1974

A friend was trying to consolidate some of the information from the 1800's and found some interesting entries in the scotlandspeople Wills entries for Foulner.
This led to finding a Fulner entry in the IGI for the birth of a William Fulner in 1825 in the Gorbals, Lanarkshire.
The name is sufficiently unusual that we feel these entries must have a direct link to your family search.

Russell

[nelmit]

I see from the IGI that James and Mary Abbey had a son in 1855. Have you looked at this entry on Scotlands People?

JOHN FOULNER
Male

Event(s):
Birth: 23 AUG 1855 Milton, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: JAMES FOULNER
Mother: MARY ABBEY


It should give the age and exact birthplace of James which could maybe help pinpointing his parents in 1841 if they were still alive.

Kind regards,
Annette M

[parrot1974]

Hi everyone
Thanks to everyone for showing interest and also for some of the ideas. I'd never thought that they could have been English, although I've never found any record of them in England. However, it would make sense if they were linked to the English Fulner family. There is a family rumour that they came over from France, but God knows how I'd check that one!
I've checked through Scotlands People, ancestry.co.uk, IGI etc. and have all the records.
However, Russell, thanks for your tip especially, as I've been checking out the English Fulner family and I'm quite optimistic that there must be a link, with the name maybe changing when they moved to Scotland, as there is only one branch of Foulners that I can find anywhere! Now all I need to do is find out where the Foulners and Fulners parted ways!
Thanks again

[chrisbaur2805]

Hello 'parrot1974',
I've just come across your 2007 exchange of most interesting information about the Foulners -- the family of my wife's Grandfather Ricard Foulner (and all earlier antecedents!). I, too, am researching their history for an account of our family. The information I have agrees with yours in many respects, but differs in others. I wonder if I might share what I have with you, and ask a few questions about your research, please?
Like you, I've established that John Foulner, the stocking-maker, had two sons -- James Foulner (born either 1819-1820, died 1873) and John Neil Foulner (born either 1819-1820, died 1895). Both were cork-cutters, supplying the wine trade (and others) with oak-cork imported from Portugal and Spain.
JAMES FOULNER married Mary Abbey (born 1821; died 1875) in 1838. They had either 8 or nine children:
Agnes (b. 1838, whose record I have not traced)
James (b.1842; d. 1865) m. Hughina Fawkner (1865)
Mary Ann (b. 1845; d. 1868) m. Ebenezer Dron (1865)
John (b. 1855; d. 1835) m. Jeanie McKenzie (1877)
Daniel Ranier (b.1852; d. 1884) m. Margaret Lambert (1883)
George (b. 1857; d. 1859)
Alfred (b. 1860; d.1876) -- he was a 15-year-old apprentice deckhand aboard the ship Culzean Castle which sank with all crew.
Andrew (mis-registered as "Alexander": b.1862; d.1863)

JOHN NEIL FOULNER married Ann Bond (b.1820; d.1884) date not known. They had five children:
Maria Jane (b. 1850; date of death not known) m. John Robertson (1871)
Harriet (b. 1856; d.1919) m. William Anderson (1874)
James (b. 1858; d.1918) m. Annie Wright (1850)
Mary Ann (b. 1848; d.1927) m. Ricard Liver Powell in Southwark, London (1871)
John (b. 1854; d.1917) m. Catherine Innes Sinclair (1879). Like his father, John jun. was also a cork-cutter. He and Catherine had five children, the youngest of whom (Ricard Liver Powell Foulner) became my wife Jaqueline's Grandfather. Ricard was born in Edinburgh in 1889, married Alice Conboy in 1907, had two sons and two daughters including Catherine, my wife's mother, and he died in1966.

JAMES FOULNER and his family remained in Glasgow, running the cork-cutting business. Although his brother, JOHN NEIL FOULNER's children were all born in Glasgow, they eventually settled in Edinburgh. The 1861 census shows that Ann and their five children had settled in Craig's Close, of the High Street. Between then and the next census in 1871, John had joined them and they were living at Simpson's Court.

Now, I have some questions I wonder if you can help me with, please:
1. WILLIAM FOULNER: Following your research, I have also now "found" what looks like a third son, WILLIAM, a warehouseman, who married a Jane Cook in Glasgow in 1849. You say he was born c. 1823, but there's nothing in his parish marriage record to suggest his age or parentage. You also say that he and Jane emigrated to New Zealand. I wonder if you can help me with sources here, please?

2. JEAN NEIL: you say that John Foulner, the stocking-maker, married Jean Neil. The only record I have found (the 1873 death certificate of their first son James) gives his mother's family name as Neil, but not her first name. Again, I wonder if there's an additional source I'm missing which gives her full names?

3. JOHN FOULNER: finally you say that you've "traced the Foulner family as far back as c. 1786". I haven't had your success in driving back that far, so I'd be fascinated to know what route you took!

I do hope some of this may be useful, and that you might be able to help me limp a few more miles back into the Foulner history!
Kind regards,
Chris Baur