Grandchildren ???.....

[puffin]

I have been trying to track some individuals described as grandchildren to the Head of a household in the 1881 census.
The head of household died in 1890 aged 94 described as a spinster. She has a different surname to those described as grandchildren.
As I have been unable to establish any direct relationship between the head of household and the " grandchildren " I am wondering if this description was used a little more loosely then, ie could they be adopted, or great grandchildren, or other ?

I can provide much more on the actual names if anyone is interested but so far I have nothing other than in the 1841 census that the mother of one is shown aged 8 as a servant in the household of the same lady ( who is then aged 40 shown living with her aged mother of 90, with no sign of any husband )

thanks

puffin

[sporran]

Hello Puffin,


please post as much information as you have on the people and I (and perhaps others) will look into the problem.


Regards,

John

[puffin]

thanks Sporran, here goes with the main information .........

1881 census

Dwelling: 36 Hadden St
Census Place: Aberdeen Old Machar, Aberdeen, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0203451 GRO Ref Volume 168-2 EnumDist 48 Page 43
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
Janet LYON U 86 F Belhelvie, Aberdeen, Scotland
Rel: Head
Occ: Formerly Dom Serv
James ROSS U 26 M Woodside, Aberdeen, Scotland
Rel: Grandson
Occ: Carter Masons
Jessie PETERS U 21 F Woodside, Aberdeen, Scotland
Rel: Grand Daug
Occ: Paper Mill Worker
Fredrick PETERS U 16 M Woodside, Aberdeen, Scotland
Rel: Grandson
Occ: Carter (Gen)

Whilst James Ross 26, Jessie Peters 21, and Fredrick Peters 16 are described as grandsons and granddaughter I can so far find no evidence of this relationship back to Janet Lyon.

Janet Lyon’s death cert. of 28th December 1890, Old Machar Aberdeen, shows her as a spinster, age 87, father George Lyon , mother Margaret Stables.

( the age given then is wrong – see birth date below – she was by that reckoning 94 )

There is also a birth record for her at Belhelvie on 14th February 1796 to these parents.
I also have siblings James ( 1799-1873 ) and William Lyon ( 1788-? ), with a fairly extensive tree for this James Lyon who was married to Martha Sangster ( c 1802 – 1877)

I can find Jessie’s birth which shows she is born Jessie Isabella Sim Peters on 24/2/1860 at Old Machar to David Peters and Mary Cameron, she also has brother Charles Frederick b 30/6/1864 and sister Maria Ann b 3/4/1862.

On 6/12/1889 Jessie married Alexander Collie age 31 son of Peter Collie ( lab decd.) and Jane Cobban decd., making her Jessie Collie. This then accords with the death certificate of Janet Lyon in 1890, where Jessie Collie is given as the witness, again described as granddaughter.

I have also found Janet Lyon on the 1841 census

1841 Census
3 Records found
Previous Household
Next HouseholdPiece: SCT1841/193 Place: Fintray-Aberdeenshire Enumeration District: 3
Civil Parish: Fintray Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 3 Page: 3
Address: Berwick

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
LYON Margret F 90 Pauper Aberdeenshire
LYON Jannet F 40 Female Servant Aberdeenshire
CAMMERON Mary Anne F 8 Female Servant Aberdeenshire

It would appear from this that Mary Anne Cammeron is the same as the mother of Jessie Peters as I have a Mary Ann Cameron marrying a David Peters at Old Machar Aberdeen, and this couple have three children – Charles Fredrick Peters b 30/6/1864, Jessie Isabella Sim Peters, b 24/2/1860, and Maria Ann Peters b 3/4/1862 all at Old Machar Aberdeen, although I have yet to prove it is the same Mary Cammeron.

However I am a little mystified by the description of grandsons and granddaughter because I have been unable to find this direct relationship back to Janet Lyon, and especially as Janet is described as a spinster ( death cert ) and unmarried ( 1881 census ). Nor have I found any marriage record of Janet Lyon to anyone called Cammeron.

Thanks

puffin

[CatrionaL]

Hullo Puffin,

Could it be that the children of the family had alsways known Janet LYON as their "grandmother", even though there was no blood relationship? They were old enough to have been the ones answering the door to the Census taker and giving him the information as they knew it.

I am "grandmother" to three children, though there is no official adoption and no blood relationship.

Just a thought.

Catriona

[sporran]

Hello Puffin,


there were some lucky breaks in this, but some inconsistencies remain.

I started with the death of Jessie Collie, who kept her age accurate. A search with birth year 1860 finds only one, in 1942, and her parents were given as David Peters and Mary Ann Cameron.

You had already found her birth with the same information, but her parents' marriage in 1859 was disguised by his signing as David Peter (and it was indexed as such), but his father was given as David Peters. Mary Ann's parents are given as James Cameron and Janet Lyall (an easy mis-hearing of Lyon). Mary's age of 29 (possibly 24 - a column line gets in the way) seems wrong, as does the 1841 census entry of 8 (female servant at 8?).

Mary Ann Peters died in 1874, and her "sister" (in-law, I think) gave her age as 35! Since she died of diarrhoea (1­­½ months!), her age may have been difficult to determine. Her parents were given as William Cameron, labourer, and Janet Lyon, and she was recorded as illegitimate.

Turning to the IGI (LDS), batch C112325 has 7 children born in Peterhead to James Cameron with no mother recorded (how did he get away with that?), with Mary Ann Cameron being born on 1 Sep 1822.

To recap, some inconsistencies, but I reckon that's a fair shot.


Regards,

John

[puffin]

Many thanks to Catriona and Sporran, I will need to take a little time to look at Sporran's data, but in the meantime am grateful for your input.

My namesake the puffin, I think, needs a downhill slope to assist its takeoff and your answers have tilted the area of research a little more in my favour.

Richard L.