Auntie Elsie

[Jean Jeanie]

“Where is Auntie Elsie?”

I embarked upon finding out more about my husband’s family some eight months ago. Not an easy task, as they are Frasers from Cromdale Morayshire. Most of them, fortunately living in a tiny place called Faebuie.

I had the good fortune to know my father in law, Lewis Fraser’s birthday was 17th October 1890 and from his wedding certificate I found his parents names were Alexander Fraser and Jane Fraser m.s. Fraser. A Fraser marrying a Fraser – what a nightmare! From Lewis’s birth certificate I obtained the date of Alexander and Jane’s wedding, 1 Jun 1877. Another piece of good fortune is that my husband’s sister is 12 years his senior and I had read that it was a good idea to glean as much information from family members as possible.

Being new to genealogy, I wasn’t sure where to look next. I then found out about the existence of Scotlandspeople on the internet and the availability of BMD’s and censuses.

As Jane and Alexander were married in 1877 they surely had to appear in the 1891 census and lo and behold they did. Lots of children there too. From their ages they were born between 1878 and 1890. I was so happy. I then found them in the 1901 census and another child had been born in 1893. Of course, I now know where they lived at both of these times. I didn’t bother with the 1881 census, as the first child shown on the 1891 census was born in 1878, just the year after Alexander and Jane were married. (Trying to save some credits on Scotlandspeople for other things)

A phone call to my sister in law a few days later was the start of the quest for Elsie Fraser. I told her of my findings and of the names of the brothers and sisters of her father, Lewis. “Where is Auntie Elsie then?” was her reply. “Auntie Elsie”, I said. “Who the heck is she?”. “She was the eldest in the family” was my sister in law’s reply!

Many pounds were spent of Scotlandspeople trying to find Elsie’s birth, but to no avail. At this point I started to look for her before Alexander and Jane’s marriage, as an aquaintance had informed me that many births at this time were illegitimate. Again no luck.

I phoned my sister in law to make sure that Elsie was a real “Auntie”, not a cousin or some such relation. She confirmed that she was a real “Auntie” and that she remembered her well, having lived with her when she was very young, when her mother had been unwell. “Have you any other information about her?” I asked. “Yes”, she said, “She was married twice, first to John McDonald and secondly to George Cameron” “Do you have any dates for these marriages”, I asked. “No”, she said, “They were married long before I was born”. Then came the piece of news that led to the first breakthrough. “I know when she died, if that is any help to you.” “How do you know that?” I asked. “Easy”, she said. “She died the year your husband, my brother, was born” 1934 – Eureka!

I found her death certificate without any trouble. She was aged 59, married (1) John McDonald (2) George Cameron and her parents were Alexander Fraser and Jane Fraser m.s. McDonald. Maiden name McDonald? Jane’s maiden name was shown as Fraser on her other children’s birth certificates. How did she become a McDonald? However I now have Elsie’s year of birth tied down to1874/5. So she was born before Alexander and Jane were married

Being relatively new to genealogy I had to have a major re think as to how to proceed.

It suddenly dawned on me that the 1881 census could provide some valuable information re Elsie. It did. She is shown as Elsie (McDougall) Fraser, stepdaughter of the head, Alexander Fraser. I also re-examined Alexander and Jane’s wedding certificate and Alexander’s parents are shown as William Fraser and Isabella Fraser m.s. Cameron. Jane’s parents are shown as William Fraser and Elspet McDonald. Jane’s parents were not married; therefore Jane could be a Fraser or McDonald

This makes things worse. If Jane is either a McDonald or Fraser and Elsie’s father is a McDougall, then Elsie could be registered as a McDonald, Fraser or McDougall. Lots more money spent on Scotlandspeople for Elsie, using the names McDonald and McDougall. Result – nothing.

To overcome my frustration at not finding her birth, I decided to look for her marriages. I looked for the second marriage first, as her name would be McDonald on this as she was widowed at the time. Even this proved hard. At last after much more spending I found it. Although residents of Grantown on Spey, for some reason they were married in Edinburgh! Elsie is shown as a widow and her parents Alexander Fraser and Jane Fraser m.s. McDonald. Her first marriage was even harder to find. Eventually it came to light and she shows her name as Elsie Fraser McDougall, parents William McDougall and Jane Fraser m.s. Fraser.

I am still no nearer to knowing her original name. Is she a McDougall after her natural father, a Fraser after her mother’s father or a McDonald after her mother’s mother!! Looking for a birth of a Jane Fraser or Jane McDonald, to substantiate Elsie’s mother’s name also proved fruitless. That fruit machine called Scotlandspeople took some hammering

All this information and still no birth record. Just who and where is this Elsie?

The second breakthrough – Moray Council have a new website and on there is LIBINDX, an index to sources of information about people, places and subjects relating to Moray. I find Elsie’s mother Jane’s birth. This was not on the OPR records as she was baptized at the Catholic Church in Tombae. She was baptized Jane Fraser (illegitimate) mother Elspet McDonald. Father William Fraser.

This now eliminates the name McDonald as Elsie’s surname and leaves me with McDougall and Fraser.

A new website www.talkingscot.com appears on the internet. A place to chat and air your genealogy problems. I ask the question “What more can I do to find Elsie” and give them all the information I have. Back came the answer that it may not be her surname that is the problem, it may be her first name. Someone did a search for Els* Fraser and found a birth in the right year in the right place for an Elspet Fraser. Realisation dawns. The Scottish naming pattern! Jane has called her daughter after her mother, Elspet. Elsie was an Elspet at birth.

Unfortunately the image was not available to view on Scotlandspeople even though it is a statutory record. So frustrating. It usually takes a few weeks to receive a certificate from them, due to the high demand

I then contacted The office of BDM’s at Moray House in Inverness, giving them all the details. They e-mailed me back the following day to say that they had found the birth. All I had to do was sent the necessary cheque and the certificate would be posted to me. This I did and the birth record was sent by return of post.

I’d found her!!! Elspet Fraser (illegitimate) Mother Jane Fraser born at Tomlea, Cromdale. Tomlea is the cottage next to the cottages at Faebuie, Cromdale, where lots of my Fraser’s lived, worked and died.

She took so long to find and to think if it hadn’t been for my 83 year old sister in law asking the question “Where is Auntie Elsie?” I may never have known of her existence.

The lessen to be learned here is speak to the elderly relatives before it is too late

Jean

[Mykayla's Gran]

Hello Jean

I'm a new member to TalkingScot but I've been popping in for a wee while and have enjoyed all the stories and discussions so much that I thought it was about time I told you so Certain members, and everyone will know who they are have had me in stitches . Just brilliant! Thanks to you all for making this a great site!

I can relate to this particular topic though Jean as I have only two aunts left, one on each side of the family, and Auntie J just isn't keen on parting with ANY information whatsoever However, after reading your post I shall certainly see if Auntie B is a little more enlightening. I do hope so! I can understand that the past may be difficult for some people to deal with though, and I wouldn't want anyone to be upset by my unwanted questions Ahh well .....!

Vee

[marilyn morning]

Hello Vee,

Welcome to TalkingScot and thank you for joining our forum. We wish you great success with all your future research.

Regards
Marilyn

[DavidWW]

Just Jean

Please let me have the reference for the second marriage in Edinburgh..... post in another thread will explain.

Thanks.

David