Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

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julieanne
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:30 am

Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by julieanne » Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:05 pm

Hi.
I have obtained my grandmother's birth certificate showing the names and occupations of her parents who were Lithuanian nationals. The bottom of the same column is for date and place of marriage which shows an Ayrshire town, the month of June although the figures are a little unclear, either "1907 June" or "190[illegible] June".

Not being too concerned about the unclear part, I searched for a marriage record but nothing appears. I wonder if there is some explanation, or whether there was some other form of registration for foreign nationals at that time...something...

I have searched their names in the various archives but if their daughter's birth certificate indeed correctly shows their approximate date of marriage and the town in Scotland, I'm stumped as to why their marriage record can't be found.

Any advice would be hugely appreciated.

WilmaM
Posts: 1533
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 10:46 am
Location: Falkirk area

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by WilmaM » Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:08 pm

There are potentially several reasons why you haven't found the marriage:
It never happened
It wasn't in the month or year noted, depending on who registered the birth the info could be inaccurate
If they had, I'm assuming, an unusual surname it can be missindexed, mispelled or recorded under something quite different.
Or may be they weren't married in Scotland but thought it easier to say they were!

Have you looked at the family on the 1911 census ? That asked how long a couple had been married for and how many children, so you could work out a year from that.

As far as I'm aware the marriage procedure is the same for everyone in Scotland.

Perhaps you could give us the actual details and we can try to help you unravel the mystery.

Falkyrn
Posts: 245
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2005 7:04 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by Falkyrn » Thu Oct 11, 2018 12:26 pm

Another option is that it was an "irregular" form of marriage recognised as a legal form and perfectly valid but unfortunately not always documented.

Since Civil Registration began in 1855 if you got married in Scotland it was registered in Scotland - The points raised by WilmaM and the advice given are both sound and practical to start your search (again)
~RJ Paton~

carolineasb
Posts: 109
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:15 pm

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by carolineasb » Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:18 pm

When searching for one of my friend's Lithuanian family it proved really quite difficult as each certificate had a totally different spelling of their names as obviously it was just written by the Registrar how it sounded to them :(

nelmit
Posts: 3929
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:49 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by nelmit » Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:52 pm

carolineasb wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:18 pm
When searching for one of my friend's Lithuanian family it proved really quite difficult as each certificate had a totally different spelling of their names as obviously it was just written by the Registrar how it sounded to them :(
That was my thought.

Do you know you can search with only first names? That might be worth a shot.

Regards,
Annette

carolineasb
Posts: 109
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:15 pm

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by carolineasb » Tue Oct 16, 2018 12:17 pm

Unfortunately, first names can be quite different too :( but it's always worth a try! And remember to use wild cards, soundex etc to see if anything jumps up!

julieanne
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:30 am

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by julieanne » Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:53 pm

Hi. Still getting nowhere! Thanks for all the advice. I appreciate all the comments re inaccurate reporting, misspellings, misrecordings due to phonetics etc; these all make sense.

My grandmother's details on the birth certificate are:
Antanina Mickevieze or could be Miekevieze - e's and c's are difficult to distinguish, born in Stevenson in 1912.

Father's name is recorded as:
Kostantinus Mickevieze

Mother's name:
Mary Mickevieze, née Syvelniute

I understand her true name was some variation of Mariona/Marjona.

There seems to be a variant which would probably be similarly pronounced which is MISKEVICZIA and a Mariona Miskeviczia who died in Irvine, Ayrshire in 1931. Also a Kostantinus Miskeviczia died in Riccarton in 1929, although I understood the families first arrived in Scotland on the East coast then dispersed. There are no marriages with this variation.

If anyone can offer any further thoughts, I would greatly appreciate them :) Thanks again.

WilmaM
Posts: 1533
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 10:46 am
Location: Falkirk area

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by WilmaM » Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:32 pm

Using fuzzy matching and phonetic searching I found this in the 1911 census:
Surname MCVEICH Forename KASTANTINES male aged 28
Place Stevenston Ayr

The census taker has written doen what he thought he heard!

Do have a look and see if its your man.

WilmaM
Posts: 1533
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 10:46 am
Location: Falkirk area

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by WilmaM » Thu Nov 15, 2018 6:05 pm

Back again - I've moved to my desktop computer, easier to coy/paste from here ;)

1911 Census, in the same household as KASTANTINES MCVEICH [ref 615/ 6/ 36]
are: MARIO [presumably his wife ] aged 31, ANTANAS aged 3 and his brother JUOZAS aged 1 year .

I then search the births:

MICKIEWICZE ANTANAS M 1908 596/ 219 Kilbirnie
MICKEVICZE JUOZAS M 1910 615/ 85 Stevenston


so looking at those records may help then when/where of the marriage.

Ah Ha! have a I cracked it for you?

Using fuzzy/Phonetic on his names yielded no results , but her surname on Phonetic matching gives:
SZWELUNITE MARYONA MICKIEWICZE TANTINUS 1908 596/ 22 Kilbirnie
The very last entry of 5 pages.

Do come back and tell us if that is them - I'm all excited \:D/

julieanne
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:30 am

Re: Marriage of foreign national couple in Scotland

Post by julieanne » Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:47 pm

O-M-G That's it!! Will have to look properly later as I'm working...but yes, my grandmother had a younger brother, "Joe", and it all looks about right! Thabnk you so much! :D \:D/ =D>

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