McMichael to Carmichael .....

laineywoo · Post by **laineywoo** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 7:21 pm

Wonder if anyone can help here. I have Galloways in my tree, and I have the photo from Polmont North Churchyard for Jane Galloway and a Samuel McMichael. In the census for 1881, it states that Samuel was born in Ireland.
I also have Carmichaels from Polmont in my main line, and unbeknown to me, I had been sitting on Samuel and Janes wedding cert for at least the last 6 months. On his wedding cert, he is listed as Samuel Carmichael, father listed as Hugh and a James [all again Carmichael] as witnesses. It looks like the witnesses were written by the registrar rather than own signatures. On Janes death cert, Samuel was the informant, and obviously couldn't write and so I presume read either, as he left his mark instead of a signature.
Now, I dont see how, with any accent, McMichael and Carmichael can be mixed up....So my question is, which name am I now to look for? Car or Mc? Who was right, stonemason or registrar and how can i tell? Are these names known to be interchangeable?

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 9:13 pm

Hi Lainey
This is probably no help whatsoever, but I can understand how, with an accent, McMichael and Carmichael could be confused. It only needs someone to "swallow" the first syllable. Given the circumstances, I think you'll need to keep an open mind on this one! Do you believe the guy who carved the gravestone or the registrar??

I think you will need to go for *Michael for the moment, and thank your lucky stars that SP allows a leading wildcard!

Best wishes
Lesley

laineywoo · Post by **laineywoo** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 9:19 pm

Hi Lesely
Thanks for that. Problem arises when I have to try searching Irish records at which I am terrible anyway!!! Think I will do post for both names and see what comes up lol
Lainey

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 9:27 pm

Lainey

I can only agree with Lesley that it could only have been too easy for the first syllable to be elided ............

David

Davie · Post by **Davie** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 9:43 pm

Hi
I have come across this wee conundrum before and also in Stirlingshire.
I would definitely go for Samuel McMichael.
I could understand any registrar in Scotland, mistaking McMichael, for Carmichael
Especially if the informant only had Erse or Gaelic.
I would doubt if anyone would replace Carmichael with McMichael.
I have researched both surnames and the latter is not a particularly common Scots one in the mid nineteenth century.
I have a McMichael family in Stirling on the 1861-1901 censuses.
Alexander Carmichael (real name McMichael!!!!) married to Elizabeth Muir. 1859.
How coincidental that both marriage records have the same error and that both Samuel and Alex have Hugh as father.
Brothers I would assume.
Both Alexander and Elizabeth Muir lived well into their 80s.
If anyone wants any info on McMichael's, especially Elizabeths, just let me know.

[/quote]Now, I dont see how, with any accent, McMichael and Carmichael can be mixed up[quote]

Lainey,
That widnae be too haurd.
I am a McNaughtan and that kin get translatit intae a few odd spellin's.
Only last year, when leaving an order for an interval drink in a theatre.
Very plainly tell't the wee punter ahint the bar' in meh best Kelvinseahd accent, that ma name wiz McNaughtan.
The said eejit gote ma name doon oan the wee ticket as Mr Norton.
Min' you it wiz in Edinburgh, so whit kin ye expect.

Davie

laineywoo · Post by **laineywoo** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 10:54 pm

Hi Davie
How interesting! I just could not think of how they would be muddled but now its dawning......takes a while but I usually get there in the end

All I have on Samuels parents are what it says on the wedding cert, which is Hugh Carmichael and Margaret Mc something poss McIntosh.......its the closest I can get anyway. I would be interested to hear who the spouse of your Hugh is? If the same or you think it will help you, I can send the typed out wedding details and a photo of the gravestone?
Technically speaking, I shouldnt really look for more info on Samuel, but thats never been known to stop me in the past, and this has got me really curious if only to find out one way or the other.
Cheers again
Lainey

Davie · Post by **Davie** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 9:57 am

Hi Lainey,
How coincidental can it get?
I have never been able to work out Alexander's mothers maiden name either.
Margaret McLuinie?
It would be interesting to see if it was the same Minister who officiated.
Alex died in 1924, aged 93. His daughter did not know his parents surnames.
I have looked at the census returns I have on file, and sure enough Samuel appears on a few of them, with his Family.
I will try and put the marriage snip in the Gallery and see what the troops on here think
Davie
http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... p?pos=-697
<image URL added by LesleyB>

laineywoo · Post by **laineywoo** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 12:15 pm

Hi Davie
I too have just uploaded the cert too see what you and others make of the surname of Samuels mother........
As I said, McIntosh was the nearest I could come to - providing the registrar just hadnt crossed the t properly!
My problem is I think I put it straight onto the gallery and not sure how to do a link???
Waiting for the OK from TS

http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... p?pos=-699

Cheers
Lainey

<image URL added by LesleyB>

JimM · Post by **JimM** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 3:17 pm

Both look very similar

k
Could it be McNicol ???

Jim

CatrionaL · Post by **CatrionaL** » Sat Aug 05, 2006 5:12 pm

I was voting for McIntosh.

Then thought that what it really looks like is McIninsh. Never heard of it but there are three OPR marriages under that name.

Best wishes

Catriona

TalkingScot.com

McMichael to Carmichael .....

McMichael to Carmichael .....

carmichael or mcmichael

McMichael/Carmichael

mcmichael/carmichael