image

[Alan SHARP]

Greetings.

Have you had a look at this site. I see they have info on the Lovat Scouts unit of 1937 which was made up using the natural skills, of the men of the land. I wonder what their less formal dress was like.

http://www.scottishmilitaryarticles.org ... MSIU12.htm

Alan SHARP.

[Currie]

Lovat Scouts in their least formal dress.
http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205197205

Alan

[Alan SHARP]

Lovat Scouts in their least formal dress.
http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205197205

Alan

Nice one, but where is the crop ?

Apologies Helen [hg]

Alan SHARP.

[Currie]

Que? Which crop?

Actually, the fellow at the back is saying to his mate "Hold still and I'll get you out of this mess."

Alan

[Adam Brown]

I would say that he was in the Royal Scots. The collar badges look like the thistles of the Royal Scots.

So many Gordons were captured in 1914 because they and another battalion surrendered when threatened with encirclement by the Germans. It is not well known, and the battalion was rebuilt very quickly to continue the fight but many men who were taken prisoner survived the horrors of the trenches because of that. It may not have seemed very lucky at the time but getting captured in the early weeks of the war will probably have saved hundreds of Gordons from serious wounds or death.

Adam

[hg]

Thanks Adam. Just wondered though why he was a seaman in 1914 but in the Royal Scots approaching ww11! Were they interchangeable?

[Currie]

Hello Helen,

At the beginning of WW1 more men enlisted in the Royal Navy than they knew what to do with, there certainly weren’t enough ships to employ them all. In September, 1914, they decided to form a body of surplus men who would perform the role of soldiers, and this was known as the Royal Naval Division. Probably the only time most of them set foot on a Navy ship was if they did so on their way to a field of battle. http://www.1914-1918.net/63div.htm

Your fellow was with the Division at the siege of Antwerp right at the very beginning of the war. His experiences of War would have been a soldier’s experiences, not a sailor’s. Seeing that the Royal Naval Division was disbanded at the end of the War, it seems more likely, if he wanted to continue military activities, that he would have enlisted in an Army regiment.

All the best,
Alan

[hg]

Hi Alan,

Thanks for the link. Sorry, I can see you sent me it already. I obviously did not read it properly before.

All the best

helen

[Montrose Budie]

A couple of people on another forum seemed to think the 1930's - Royal Scots. I was thinking the late 1930's because the older boy - my uncle was born 1926, I think he looks about 13, so the dates tie in.

all the best

Helen

Hi Helen

I'd agree as regards The Royal Scots, the 1st of Foot, aka "Pontius Pilate's Bodyguard"; based on the collar badge, as Adam Brown has already suggested.

See http://www.britishmilitarybadges.co.uk/ ... -p-99.html for the distinctive collar badge.

The cap badge, as commented, is rather fuzzy, never mind partly side-on, but it is possible to say that it's not the RSF, Cameronians, The Black Watch, The Cameron Highlanders, The Seaforths, or the Gordons, as the general shapes don't match.

That leaves the KOSB, Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders, HLI, and The Royal Scots. The shape of the regimental badges of all 4 would fit the fuzzy image here.

An examination of the collar badges of the KOSB, ASH & HLI, however, shows that the collar badge here cannot belong to them, thereby confirming the regiment as The Royal Scots.


As previously mentioned, the Royal Naval Division was originally formed from surplus RN seamen, but, once it became part of the army on active service, it's perfectly possible that soldiers from other army regiments would be posted to the RND.

This could well match the apparantly contradictory info that has come down the family regarding both army and navy service.

Obviously, some nephews or nieces, hearing that he had served in the RND, could easily assume that this meant service in the Royal Navy ! Others, hearing that he was at Antwerp would reasonably assume that army service was involved.

Note that the obituary of his father Peter refers to son James serving in the RNVR. That's the Royal Navy Volunteer Reserve. This implies that he had some maritime connection prior to WWI, but not linked to his occupation.

Has any relevant info come down the family ?

If the connection had involved the merchant navy, etc., then he would automatically have been a member of the RNR, - The Royal Naval Reserve, - not the RNVR.

mb