Life as Gardening Staff in 19th Century Lanarkshire

[marypryde]

Thanks, anyway. When I receive the Hamilton and High Blantyre MI's, I will be able to return the favor. I will also have Dalserf and some parts of Fife for reference. Keep that in mind, please. I can't contribute local or technical knowledge, but it's time I had something to offer everyone, instead of just taking all the help.
Mary Ellen

P.S. - I've also ordered a copy of "The Head Gardeners." Sounds like it will add wonderful flavor to this quest.

[Andrew C.]

I know your image of Lanarkshire has now been refreshed, however I will do my bit for Lanarkshire tourism. Dalserf Kirk is a really nice church and very historic. It is in what we call Clydeside which is a popular jaunt for us in the more Industrial parts of Lanarkshire as it is nice drive and has plenty of garden centres. If you are planning to stay near Dalserf and have some cash the Poppinjay Hotel in Rosebank or the New Lanark Hotel are worth a look. The New Lanark Hotel is an historic converted mill close to the Falls of Clyde.

Calderwood Castle, I don't know East Kilbride very well however is there any chance this is the house in Calderglen Country Park which is still standing?

[marypryde]

Thank you, Andrew. Actually I'm heading to Scotland next week. I will be staying in Fife but will absolutely have at least one day trip to Dalserf. Have found some of my ancestors in the churchyard booklet.

From what I understand, Calderglen Park may contain what little is left of the castle. I was able to find some photos on the internet of Calderwood Castle in its heyday. My great-grandfather was apparently the last head gardener/estate manager before it was sold in 1904. He must have been sad to leave it and move to the USA.

Regards, Mary Ellen

[Andrew C.]

Mary

If Calderwood Castle is the house at Claderglen park then the main body of the house is still there although from distant memory I think the ground floor is an information office and upstairs offices.

Dalserf is about 25 minutes by car from EK I would recommend you carry on up the road through Rosebank to New Lanark which is worth a visit

Off corse if you are in Fife I would redommend visits to St.Andrews. Crail and Anstruther and Lower Largo where Alexander Selkirk who Robinson Crusoe was based is from.

[marypryde]

Thank you for the suggestions. Here's what I have from (some website or other) about Calderwood Castle:

"Sir William Maxwell, the last baronet, ...died without any children in 1885, his widow living on until 1942. ...The Irish peer, Lord Farnham was the male heir to Sir William and he sold the barony in 1904 when it was only about one quarter of its original size at only 1113 acres. The house was irregularly used over the next forty years although the gardens were well maintained and opened to the public as a pleasure park. The house and tower were demolished as late as 1955, too soon to be protected by the Historic Buildings Act. The barony lands are now almost completely built over by the new town of East Kilbride although the leafy river valley of Calderglen remains a public park." I am guessing that my great-grandfather stayed on during the transition from private home to public property because he remarried at the castle in 1905, had the two boys there, and then immigrated in 1911.

Rosebank is also of interest to me since my 2xgreat grandparents lived there for at least 45 years that I can document. They were the parents of the Calderwood head gardener and are both buried in Dalserf churchyard.

On the Fife end, I am looking forward to seeing the coastal villages but any ancestors would have been inland (coalminers, farmers, tailors, etc) who were in the St. Andrews/Ceres/Largo area. Fife and Lanarkshire come together when my grandfather, coal miner's son, wanders from Fife to Calderwood Castle and marries the gardener's daughter.

Too much information, I'm sure! Best regards, Mary Ellen

[Andrew C.]

I hope you enjoy your trip. I also have Fife miners in my tree who migrated west to Lanarkshire. There is a good chance your ancestors house at Rosebank is still standing as most of the houses there are quite old. Same at Ceres which is a lovely little village (oldest highland games in the world - although it is not in the highlands?) named after the goddess of the harvest. Don't go motorway from Fife to lanarkshire go Kincardine bridge way as it is a nicer journey although they may be working on the bridge. I am sure someone will best advise you when your over,

[LesleyB]

Origin of the place name, Ceres
"Place to the west". Siar (Gaelic) = west, probably in relation to St Andrews. Locational endings in -es are common in East Fife. Suggestions that the name originated from an early dedication of the local kirk, such as to "Saint Siris", Saint Cyrus or Saint Cyricus are now discounted
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceres,_Fife

In The Place Names of Fife and Kinross, by WM Liddall (Wm Green & Sons, 1896) it was suggested that Ceres was derived from the Norse syr + reit = enclosure for swine.
It was suggested that it might be connected with St Cyrus. There is no reference to a St Cyrus in the Penguin Dictionary of Saints other than Cyrus of Alexandria (c303). The village of St Cyrus, Kincardineshire, seems to have been named after St Cyr or Ciricus (Quiricus) martyr of Tarsus.
The 1882 Ordnance Gazetteer says St Cyr was Ceres' pre-Reformation saint.
en.allexperts.com/e/c/ce/ceres,_fife.htm

CERES: ( seer-iss) Enclosure for swine.
CERES: obscure, but possibly 'black water' ; searach (Gaelic).
http://www.thefifepost.com/pofifemeanings.html

Ceres. Sireis. Norse syr + reit = enclosure for swine.
For full explanation see Rires.
Rires. Riras, Rerays {schira de). A comparison of this
name with such names as Rywrayis, Bulwrayis in
Renfrew, and Wrae or Wraith in various districts,
points out as the explanation of the latter part of the
name the old Scottish word Wread or Wreath,
signifying a small enclosure for confining cattle or
for growing crops. The " reed " is still the name in
Fife for the court where cattle are enclosed in winter.
The term appears in Old Norse in such words as naep-
nareitr, a place for growing turnips. Rerays signifies
enclosures for growing rye. The root idea is tying
up or enclosing ; in Gothic vrithus means a herd.
http://www.archive.org/stream/placename ... d_djvu.txt

[Andrew C.]

Ceres is the Roman goddess of agriculture etc. and I always believed this rural Fife village was named after her, however I stand corrected if this is not the case.

I just noticed the old Norse word for turnip very similar to our word neep.

[LesleyB]

Hi Andrew

Ceres is the Roman goddess of agriculture etc. and I always believed this rural Fife village was named after her

I used to think some time ago that this was the obvious reference too, but I remembered reading somewhere that it was not. Seems it is more complex and less Roman than thought!!

I just noticed the old Norse word for turnip very similar to our word neep.

Yes - looks like that is maybe where that word has come from. Scots is such a mixture of influences and vocabulary, some of the words clearly related to those used in English, but so many words that have no relation to English words at all. It is amazing to think how it has all evolved, and that so many of us are, in effect, bilingual, although not generally recognised as such, understanding both broad Scots and English!

Best wishes
Lesley

[marypryde]

Fascinating! I'm not a linguist but I am very interested and seem to have an ability to "pick up" what I hear (put me in New York for a week and I'll sound like a New Yorker.)

On the phone, the tour guide sounds just like my Fife grandfather. I understood him when I was a child. My hope for the upcoming visit is that my brain has it stored somewhere and it will come back.
Mary Ellen