Archibald Whyte

[Scoop]

Wondering if anyone can help.

My grandmother was born Isabella Whyte (deceased), Blackburn, 1920. Her biological father was unknown until recently when I found her birth certificate. His name was Archibald Whyte but I don't know much about him except when my grandmother was born, his residence was (I think) Barraton Farm, Sandbank, Argyll. I'm led to believe this is Dunoon. I am unsure about the name of the farm and wondering if anyone knew anything about the farm or have I got the right name?

The URL with part of the extract (well, the bit that contains the information) is below:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/118151/scan0001.jpg

I had to scan this in and it is as good as I can get it.

The story in the family that Archibald was killed on a farm by a bull (this is certainly what my grandmother believed) but I don't know if I believe that given that my grandmother was known as Forrester (mother's maiden name) then Renfrew (adopted father's name). The adopted father was married to her mother in 1923. There seems to be cover up going on The mother worked on a farm on the east coast and he was on the west coast.

Thanks.

[SarahND]

Hi Scoop,
Could this be Archibald (and his father also Archibald) in 1901?

1901
Old School House, Dunoon and Kilmun, Argyll
Archibald Whyte, 33, Head, born Sandbank, Argyllshire, Workman
Margaret Whyte, 7, Daur, born Dunoon & Kilmun, Argyllshire, Scholar
Archibald Whyte, 5, Son, bon Dunoon & Kilmun, Argyllshire, Scholar
Isabella Scott, 28, Serv, born Glassary, Kilmichael, House Keeper

It looks as if his mother died when he was very young (unless she was just visiting elsewhere on census night). If you find the marriage of Archibald Sr, then you should be able to identify the correct death record for this Archibald.

There is only one likely marriage for Archibald Sr and that was in Dunoon in 1892.

There are only seven Archibald Whytes born 1896 +/-3 years who died in all of Scotland between 1919 and 2009, so it would not cost a fortune to find out which one is correct. It doesn't look as if any of them died before 1923, however… so perhaps you're right about the cover up

Good luck!
Sarah

[nelmit]

I saw that one too Sarah although there is another born at Kilmun around 1900.

The Archibald born 1895 married at Ardnadam Farm, Sandbank 23rd August 1920 although his address at the time was Stonehouse, Cairndow. Pity Isabella's father didn't give his occupation when he signed the birth register.

Including this one there were 3 births at SP of an Alexander Whyte 1895 +/- 1 year but only 2 deaths. As far as I can tell neither of the deaths were of the one born at Dunoon. Nor can I find a death for his wife. So perhaps he died outside Scotland.

Regards,
Annette

[Scoop]

Thanks for the help.

Archibald's occupation is listed as a farmer in birth certificate.

I came across that Archibald too but his occupation was listed as a joiner but his father was listed as a farmer. It could be that he took up farming later once his dad was deceased.

[emanday]

I'm going to set the cat amongst the pigeons, but this is too much of a coincidence!

I've found an Archibald Whyte in the WW1 Pension Records. He joined the army in 1891 at 17 years old, born 1874, and gives his address as a farm owned by a Mr Drummond with what appears to be a similar name as you gave, (handwriting pretty bad). He states his occupation as JOINER. His next of kin is shown as his father Mr A Whyte, of Ardnadam Farm, Sandbank, Argyll.

Initially he joined the Clyde RSA, but appears to have joined the Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders in 1911. He served with them till 1916 when he was discharged. His Victory and British War medals were sent to Ardnadam Farm, Sandbank, Argyll. (This is the address where he later married Catherine McDougal)

Bear with me?

What if Archie's age on the actual church register was mistranscribed from 45 to 25, making his birth c1875, closer to the 1874 of the one I found?

What if the mystery/cover up is because he was already married to Catherine McDougal when he fathered Isabella?

I'm ducking now

[grannysrock]

Good morning everyone

I think Mary has found a good 'un. =D>

What if Archie's age on the actual church register was mistranscribed from 45 to 25, making his birth c1875, closer to the 1874 of the one I found?

I just took a look at the Service Record . I think the enlistment year was 1911 not 1891 - it's unclear on the first page , but later on in the record it is shown as 30th March 1911. ... meaning he was claiming to have been born about 1894 or so .

I also took a good look at the signatures. - He appears to have had 2 different ways of writing his name ! One looks totally wrong , but the other looks identifical ( to my old eyes) to the one on the birth certificate ...

I can't remember how to embed the images , and I need to perform chauffeur duties now . .. If nobody beats me to it , I'll have a go later.

Cheers
Sally

[nelmit]

Or........................it was Archibald senior (the widowed farmer) who was Isabella's father??

[grannysrock]

Annette that is definitely something to consider .
Here hopefully are all the signatures together :




Sally

[Scoop]

Thanks everyone for all the help.

I suspected that the younger Archibald Whyte if he is the father was married and the story about the bull is bull . My great-grandmother worked on East Breich Farm, Blackburn, Livingston, my grandmother was born there and Archibald worked on a farm in Dunoon. That's quite odd because of the geography involved and it suggests that maybe one ran away from another, did she get sent away when the pregnancy was found out or that they put distance between themselves to cover it up. I don't know. Why put his name on the birth certificate and sign it? Maybe it was moral obligation.

I thought the older Archibald might be the father as well because of his occupation being listed as a farmer and his wife being deceased but it is looking increasingly likely that the younger Archibald Whyte (judging by the signatures) is the person that I'm looking for.

[emanday]

Sally,

The Pension record document is dated 1891, when he joined the Clyde RSA.

British Army WWI Pension Records 1914-1920
Name: Archibald Whyte
Estimated birth year: abt 1874
Age at Enlistment: 17
Birth Parish: Kilmaron (Mistranscribed from Kilmun)
Birth County: Argyleshire
Document Year: 1891
Regimental Number: 76
Number of Images: 11

The 1911 refers to the year he either transferred to or re-enlisted to the Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders. The alteration at the top of the first page shows Clyde RSA scored out and the Argyll's written in. He was also given a new Regimental number in 1911.

Just a wee mention - my husband used to get a lot of stick from his bank about his continually alternating the capital A in his first name when signing cheques and the like. Sometimes he used the "rounded" version and other times he used the "pointed" version.