Drowning

[Pandabean]

I have just uploaded part of the RCE.

http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... p?pos=-843

I am trying to work out what the writting says and what some parts of it mean.

This is what I can make out:

6th Cause of Death - Drowning by falling into said canal, (something) at death. A Post mortem (something) in death made by David Handon Surgeries? Falkirk


Procurator Fiscale After Falkirk 17th February 1883

Certified by John Grant. 7th March 1883




The somethings are the bits I cannot make out.

What does it mean by the Procurator Fiscale part?


Thanks,
Andy

Gallery URL added - AndrewP

[AndrewP]

Hi Andy,

Here is my interpretation of the RCE.

• 6th Cause of death -
  
  Drowning by falling into
  said Canal. Accidental
  death. A Post Mortem
  sworn(?) in at court(?) made by
  David Haddon surgeon(?)
  Falkirk
  Certified by John Gant
  Procurator Fiscal
  7th March 1883
  
  Procurator Fiscals office
  Falkirk 17th February 1883

6th will probably refer to the 6th column of the Death Certificate.

I assume that the case was brought to the Procurator Fiscal's office on 17th February and that the court made its decision on 7th March. The Procurator Fiscal (a Scottish term) is the official whose duties include those which may be carried out by a coroner elsewhere.

All the best,

AndrewP

[apanderson]

Hi Panda,

Have you got the details from the 1881 Cencus for Andrew & his family? If not here they are:

Dwelling: 5 Middle St
Census Place: Falkirk, Stirling, Scotland

Andrew ROBB, age 39, Birthplace: Polmont, Stirlingshire
Rel: Head, Occ: Dock Labourer
Mary Hill ROBB, age 43, Birthplace: Cumbernauld, Dunbartonshire
Rel:Wife, Handicap: Lunatic, Occ: Labourers Wife
Elizabeth ROBB, age 13, Birthplace: Laurieston, Stirlingshire
Rel: Daur, Occ: Domestic Servant
Mary ROBB, age 10, Birthplace: Laurieston, Stirlingshire
Rel: Daur, Occ: Scholar
Janet ROBB, age 8, Birthplace: Laurieston, Stirling, Scotland
Rel: Daur, Occ: Scholar

I also came across this:

There appears to be another Mary Hill or Robb?

Institution: "Stirling Dist Asylum For The Insane"
Census Place: Larbert, Stirlingshire

Mary HILL OR ROBB, Married, age 42
Rel:Patient, Handicap: Lunatic

I noticed that Andrew's mother Elizabeth was still alive on his death certificate so I looked for her. The only likely candidate is this one (providing she stayed within the area)

Dwelling: 21 Kerse Lane
Census Place: Falkirk, Stirlingshire

Elizabeth. ROBB, Widow, age 65, Birthplace: Falkirk, Stirlingshire
Rel: Head

Just by co-incidence, I found another Robb Family . . .

Dwelling: 3 Back Middle St
Census Place: Falkirk, Stirlingshire

George ROBB, age 36, Birthplace: Polmont, Stirlingshire
Rel: Head, Occ: Dock Labourer
Joan ROBB, age 40, Birthplace; Airth Parish, Stirlingshire
Rel: Wife, Occ: Dock Labourers Wife
George ROBB, AGE 17, Birthplace: Falkirk, Stirlingshire
Rel: Son, Occ: Lath Splitter Working
Susan T. ROBB, age 13, Birthplace: Laurieston, Stirlingshire
Rel: Daur, Occ: Domestic Servant
Elizabeth B. ROBB, age 11, Birthplace: Both Kennar, Stirlingshire
Rel: Daur, Occ: Scholar
Joan ROBB, age 9 , Birthplace: Grangemouth, Stirlingshire
Rel: Daur, Occ: Scholar
Isabella ROBB, age 6, Birthplace: Grangemouth, Stirlingshire
Rel: Daur, Occ: Scholar
Helen ROBB, age 3, Birthplace: Grangemouth, Stirlingshire
Rel: Daur
Agnes ROBB, age 1, Birthplace: Grangemouth, Stirlingshire

Andrew's brother perhaps?

While I was on a roll, I had a wee look in the British Vital Records and bingo! Here's all Andrew's siblings (All born in Polmont):

ROBB, Elizabeth, Birth Date: 28 Nov 1838, Christening Date: 17 Dec 1838
ROBB, Jean, Birth Date: 28 Nov 1838, Christening Date: 17 Dec 1838
ROBB, Peter, Birth Date: 31 Jul 1840, Christening Date: 18 Aug 1840
ROBB, Andrew, Birth Date: 19 Oct 1842, Christening Date: 24 Oct 1842
ROBB, George, Birth Date: 7 Apr 1844, Christening Date: 19 May 1844
ROBB, Agnes, Birth Date: 4 Nov 1845, Christening Date: 16 Nov 1845
ROBB, David, Birth Date: 2 Dec 1847, Christening Date: 12 Dec 1847

Anne

[apanderson]

Sorry - duplicate post deleted!

[Pandabean]

apanderson

Thanks for that. I do indeed have those census records plus another couple of Andrews Brothers (eg Peter).

Thanks for finding a possible Elizabeth. I would need to check it with what I have to see if it is indeed her. As for George Robb I have traced him down to a Linlithgow Poorhouse where he died in 1879. No other names were on the Death certificate.

As for Mary Hill or Robb. I had found her and she died in 1907 due to Senile Decay. I am pretty sure as to whether the records for Stirling survive.

[paddyscar]

Here is my interpretation of the RCE.

• 6th Cause of death -
  
  Drowning by falling into
  said Canal. Accidental
  death. A Post Mortem
  sworn(?) in at court(?) made by
  David Haddon surgeon(?)
  Falkirk
  Certified by John Gant
  Procurator Fiscal
  7th March 1883
  
  Procurator Fiscals office
  Falkirk 17th February 1883

I did the same transcription as AndrewP, except for:

• ... A Post Mortem
  Exam_in_at_ion made by

I have a tendency to create disjointed words as I write, so it may only be a personal quirk.

Frances

[DavidWW]

Here is my interpretation of the RCE.

• 6th Cause of death -
  
  Drowning by falling into
  said Canal. Accidental
  death. A Post Mortem
  sworn(?) in at court(?) made by
  David Haddon surgeon(?)
  Falkirk
  Certified by John Gant
  Procurator Fiscal
  7th March 1883
  
  Procurator Fiscals office
  Falkirk 17th February 1883

I did the same transcription as AndrewP, except for:

• ... A Post Mortem
  Exam_in_at_ion made by

I have a tendency to create disjointed words as I write, so it may only be a personal quirk.

Frances

Frances

Weel done

I've been puzzling over those "words", which turn out in reality just to be the one, in hindsight, very obvious word.

David

[Pandabean]

Paddyscar

Thank you. It looks so obvious now.

[nelmit]

I know I'm a bit late but I put mine in the wrong thread.

I know others will do better but I like to have a wee go so here's my attempt.

6th - Cause of death.
Drowning by falling into said canal. ---------- at death. A post mortem examination made by David Hannon? Surgeon Falkirk.
Certified by John Gait?
Procurator Fiscal
7th March 1883

Lesley - you'll need to back to Cathy's Ireland post http://talkingscot.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6713 and change the link as she put the wrong date.

Kind regards,
Annette M

[LesleyB]

hi Annette
I'd have to admit to being a bit confused now....
I added the link to Cathy's image after you had replied to her post, so I'm not sure if there was an image linked there before, which you had seen, but there wasn't one at the time I added one.... aw heck, this is beginning to sound awffy complicated!! And I don't know if it is the correct image or not at the moment, cos I'm still wating to hear back from Cathy

...if you followed this, you deserve a large drink!

Best wishes
Lesley