Poet Aliman married Agnes Arnot(born 1828 Campsie)

[kiwibird56]

I am trying to piece together the family of my GGreatGrandparents John Arnot and Agnes McGilchrist.
This query concerns one of their daughters. In my aunts 1976 travel diary after meeting cousins in Lenzie she writes "one daughter Agnes married the poet Aliman". To me that sounds like Aliman the poet must have been well known but I have googled the name and nothing comes up about a mid 1800's poet in Scotland named Aliman. I have also tried ScotlandsPeople for their marriage but no luck there. Agnes was 13 and at home in the 1841 census but not listed at home in the 1851 census.
Any suggestions for where I could look for them would be greatly appreciated.
Kind Regards
Chris in NZ

[Rodeo]

Hi Chris

The 1851 Scotland Census shows an Agnes Arnot, age 21, born in Campsie, Stirling, employed as a servant in Auchinleck House, Duntocher, Old Kilpatrick, Dumbartonshire.

William Donald, 35, Head, b. Old Kilpatrick, Dumbarton, Farmer
Agnes Donald, 70, Mother, b.Old Kilpatrick, Dumbarton
Alexander Pollock, 30, b. New Kilpatrick, Dumbarton, Ploughman
John Donald, 27, b. Dunoon, Argyle, Farm Servant
Cathrine (sic) McCartney, 30, b. Lanarkshire, Servant
Agnes Arnot, 21, b. Campsie, Strling, House Servant

Could this be your Agnes? As you know, one can't rely on the accuracy of ages in the census as the informant may have unwittingly given the enumerator misinformation, which was often the case with regard to household staff. While her age is a couple of years out, this appears to be a strong possibility for your elusive Agnes.

Cheers,

Rodeo

[kiwibird56]

Hi Rodeo,

Many thanks for this info. It does look very promising that she is my Agnes Arnot.
Another piece to add to the family jigsaw puzzle.

Kind Regards
Chris in NZ - at 12.30 in the morning!

[momat]

HI Chris,

Have you seen this site http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Scottish_poets
Don't know if it is of any help ,but just in case the name is incorrect there may be a lead here.

Cheers from another Kiwi.

[kiwibird56]

Hi Maureen

Thanks for this suggestion. I've had a look on this site and tried different variations of Aliman but no luck so far. When I googled Aliman it came up with the variation 'Al Iman' which I believe is an Islamic name but still no poets with this name in mid 1800 Scotland. Still this opens up a new direction to look into.

Cheers
Chris in NZ

[kiwibird56]

Hi folks, An update for this posting after a very generous gentleman Jack has done some investigating for me as follows.

A rather elusive young lady is Agnes Arnot.
As on your TalkingScot post I could only find the same possible Agnes in 1851
that Rodeo found, and that is the Campsie born 21yr old at Faifley.
Looks like this Agnes married her employer in November 1854 - pity not 1855 or later.
William DONALD & Agnes ARNOT.
Marriage: 17 November 1854, Old Kilpatrick, Dunbartonshire.
No parents are mentioned - original OPR page has been looked at.
So we don't have a MC with her parents' names.

This couple had a son William Donald b. Jan 1857 - sadly the wee soul only lived 2 days.
William DONALD, b. 27 January 1857, Auchinleck Farm, Duntocher, Old Kilpatrick.
William DONALD, (2 days) d. 29 Jan 1857, Auchinleck Farm. He was buried in the Old Kilpatrick Churchyard.

But alas, no Lair records to see if there was anyone else buried in the same plot.
West Dunbartonshire Cemetery Dept. records only start at 1871.
I also asked the OK Church itself but they say no earlier lair records either.
Nor the Clydebank Reference library - I tried there too.
So seems, at present anyway, there are no lair records for OK cemetery prior to 1871.

We can now only hope there's a headstone for wee William with parents' names on it too.
I was hoping to at least find the the year of his mother's death.
I don't know when I'll be able to visit the graveyard to check - some dry days needed!
And as I've no idea of where he is buried it may take a while to search.
Also that, if there is a stone, it is still legible after 150+ years.

As the 1861 census shows his father as a Widower we can only presume this is true.
1861 census. 501. ED 11. p 1. West or Old Kilpatrick: Dunbartonshire.
Address: West Muirhouses.
FILSHIE, Robert, Head, 49, Farmer Of 700 Acres Employing 6 Men b. Old Kilpatrick
FILSHIE, Margaret, Wife, 40, Farmers Wife, b. Old Kilpatrick ....... [m/s DONALD]
FILSHIE, Agnes, Daughter, 15, Farmers Daur, b. Old Kilpatrick
FILSHIE, Janet, Daughter, 12, Scholar, b. Old Kilpatrick
FILSHIE, Margaret, Daughter, 9, Scholar, b. Old Kilpatrick
FILSHIE, Ann, Daughter, 7, Scholar, b. Old Kilpatrick
FILSHIE, Helen, Daughter, 5, ----------b. Old Kilpatrick
FILSHIE, Robert, Son, 1,----------------b. Old Kilpatrick
DONALD, William, Bro-In-Law, WIDOWER, 45, Retired Farmer, b. Old Kilpatrick
CAMERON, Catherine, Servant, Unmarried, 17, Dairy Maid, b. Kilmalley, Argyllshire
COATS, Christina, Servant, Unmarried, 20, Dom Servant, b. Blantyre, Lanarkshire

William DONALD (49 yrs) Retired Farmer, died 10 Apr 1862, West Muirhouses.
WIDOWER of Agnes ARNOTT.
Cause - Pulmonary Consumption, about 5 mos. Informant - John Donald, brother.
Nothing to point to it not being as such - except difficulty finding a wife's DC!

So if father William truly was a widower in 1861 then Agnes should've died 1857-1861.
And you'd expect it to be in the Old Kilpatrick area too.
But there is no DC in OK in these five years for his wife Agnes at all.
I checked the original OK handwritten index pages for these years.
(the Agnes Donald who d.1860 was 81yrs and the widow of a Mr Park, a slater)
And no other suitable Agnes Arnot / Donald DC in all of Scotland either.
So it's a bit of a mystery just now as to what happened to this Agnes...........end of Jacks research

It's a long stretch but from this info I am wondering if descendents of William Donald's siblings mentioned here (John Donald and Margaret Filshie) might know what happened to this Agnes Arnot. There is the possibility that this Agnes could have brought shame on the family and gone off with this poet called Aliman and hence no Death Certs for her as Agnes Donald. Then again this Agnes might be a different Agnes Arnot to the one who according to my family legend married the poet Aliman.

Any suggestions of where to go from here are very welcome!
Many thanks from Chris in NZ