Families "Spalding", "Ogilvy" and others in 16th century Angus

[Uli L.]

Hello everybody,

since this is my first post here I want to introduce myself first: I'm Uli from Germany and I'm doing genealogy as a hobby for a couple of years now. As part of this, I'm also researching my wifes ancestors and this is what brought me here. She is descendant from merchants from Hamburg, who in turn have among their ancestors some merchants from Mecklenburg (also in northern Germany) by the name of Spalding. These Spaldings can be traced back to one Andreas Spalding (+1650 in Plau am See). And that is where the connection to Scotland starts: Andreas was according to the records actually born as Andrew Spalding around 1590 in Milnhaugh and later migrated to Mecklenburg and married a German woman. He had a brother named Hans / John Spalding who emigrated to Sweden around the same time.

Here are some information about them:
https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/history/ss ... hp?id=6717
https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/history/ss ... hp?id=4677

In 1675 John and his son Gabriel requested a birth brief from the King of England to proof their noble heritage and receive recognition as noblemen in Sweden. This birth brief has been preserved, a transcript can be found in this book (p. 188f):

https://archive.org/details/scotsineast ... 8/mode/1up

It lists the parents, grand-parents and in one case great-grand-partens of John (and therefore also Andrew). But so far I have not been able to find any more information about the people mentioned. This is of course not made easier by the letter being written in Latin (which makes it harder to find the "correct" names as they were used in the time).

Here is what the birth brief mentions about the ancestors of John and Andrew; I write the name as written in Latin and put my interpretation of the names in paranthesis:

1, subject: John Spalding

2, father: Georgio Spalding, comarcha de Milhaugh (George Spalding from Milnhaugh)
3, mother: Helena Ogilvia (Helen Ogilvy)

4, paternal grandfather: Georgio Spalding, Toparcha de Grange Airly (George Spalding, master? of Grange of Airly)
5, paternal grandmother: Isabella Ogilvia (Isabel Ogilvy)
6, maternal grandfather: Guilelmi Ogilvie, baronis de Keiler (William Ogilvy, Baron of Keillor)
7, maternal grandmother: Maria Collesia (Mary Collace)

8, paternal grandfathers father: Jacobo Spalding, Toparcha de Grange Airly (Jacob or James Spalding, master? of Grange of Airly)
9, paternal grandfathers mother: Joanna Gairnes (Jane Gairnes)
10, paternal grandmothers father: Gualteri Ogilvie, baronis de Clova (Walter Ogilvy, Baron of Clova)
11, paternal grandmothers mother: Margarete Creightoun (Margaret Crichton)
12, maternal grandfathers father: Roberti Ogilvie, baronis de Keilor (Robert Ogilvy, Baron of Keillor)
13, maternal grandfathers mother: Anna Lindsei (Anne Lindsay)
14, maternal grandmothers father: Alexandri Colessii, baronis de Bellinamoon (Alexander Collace, Baron of Ballinamon?) [I can only find places named Ballinamona and Ballinamore in Ireland, nothing in Scotland]
15, maternal grandmothers father: Helenae Carnegiae (Helen Carnegie)

16, father of 8: ?
17, mother of 8: ?
18, father of 9: domini Gairnes baronis de Lantoun (Mr. Gairnes, Baron of Lantoun?) [I don't know which place this could be; Langton in Berwickshire is probably to far away to be meant here]
19, mother of 9: ?
20, father of 10: ?
21, mother of 10: ?
22, father of 11: domini Crightonii baronis de Ruthven (Mr. Crichton, Baron of Ruthven)
23, mother of 11: ?
24, father of 12: Davidis Ogilvie (David Ogilvy)
25, mother of 12: Euphemiae Forbesiae (Euphemia Forbes) [daughter of domini baronis de Forbes / the baron of Forbes]
26, father of 13: domini Lindsei baronis de Eagle et Gleneske [Mr. Lindsay, Baron of Eagle? and Glenesk)
27, mother of 13: ?
28, father of 14: ?
29, mother of 14: ?
28, father of 15: domini baronis de Carnegie postea vero comitis de Southesk (the Baron of Carnegie, who later became the Earls of Southesk)
29, mother of 15: ?

I hope this information is presented in a way that makes you able to understand it.

So what is it I'm looking for? Firstly, I would like to know if you think I made any mistakes so far. Secondly, I would like help with the interpretation of the place names that I couldn't find yet (Eagle, Lantoun, Ballinamon). And thirdly and most importantly I would like to get more information about these people and fill in the missing ancestory, especially where I have some information (like the Crichton of Ruthven baron as number 22 or the Carnagie Earl of Southesk as number 28 - there are so many that I have no idea who exactly it might be).

I am quite experienced in finding information in Germany, but I have no idea where I may find anything related to Scotland, let alone Scottish nobles of the 16th century. So any help would be highly appreciated. If you need any additional information let me know and I'll try to help.

Best wishes from Munich,
Uli

[WilmaM]

A very big Scottish Uli,
That's quite an impressive family that you have there, most of us can only dream of breaking the 1700's barrier with available records.

I had a quick look at some maps, google maps to start with and the National Library of Scotland' georeferenced ones and struck lucky on a couple, I hope.

There is a house called Balnamoon near Brechin, on modern maps. North west of the City of Brechin beside Tigerton, Belliehill and Kirkton of Menmuir.
Canmore has a little history of it: https://canmore.org.uk/site/35078/balnamoon-house
Roy's map has it as Bonnymoon, and it is just to the south of the Brown & White Caterthuns [Iron-age Hillforts]
Side by side 1843-1882 map and Roy's 1747-1752
https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by ... =5&right=3

Eagle popped up on the Roy map of the Highlands [1747 - 1752] and I think it is the early name for, or corruption of Edzell.
Looking at them side by side 1843-1882 & Roy's map you can see many of the place names and geographical features are similar.
https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by ... =5&right=3
Edzell Castle was the seat of the Lindsay family, and lots can be found on-line about it.

I hope that gives you some places to start looking for further information on these families.

[WilmaM]

As far as resources for searching further:
Scotlands People [link at top of page] is the official records site of Scotland. A pay-per-view basis but the indexes are free to search. Official Statutory records only date from 1855, but there are Church Records back until 1553 [ but there is no certainty about the completeness of those, or even if they survived]
The period of time you are searching in will be rather sparse for Birth, Death & Marriage details.
There are also Kirk Session Records, these are records of church business and are not indexed but can be trickier to search .
There are sections of Maps & Plans, Images and Place search too.
There are very good 'how to' sections on all these areas, but feel free to ask on here too.

Scotlands Places is another official database: https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/
you may find more for your era there: hearth taxes, cart & servant taxes. Place names in the 17th & 18th centuries.
I'm not very proficient at using that one.

The National Library of Scotland, I previously mentioned has wonderful maps, and other resources that , I confess, I am fairly unfamiliar with.
I'm not certain if Burkes Peerage https://www.burkespeerage.com/ would be of any help for you , or if their records are too recent.

Do let us know how you fare, and don't hesitate to ask for further guidance.

[Uli L.]

Hi Wilma,

thank you for your warm welcome. Yes, I'm pretty lucky to have information that far back on that line. For myself I never got further than 1720 on one line and most others stop around 1750 at the latest. In this case it is only possible because the richest merchant families of Hamburg were quite meticulous with their own records and can be traced back for a long time. There is also something Burke's Peerage but for non-noble families in Germany, called the "Deutsche Geschlechterbuch" (="Book of German Houses/Families"), which also covers the Mecklenburg Spaldings in one volume.

Sadly my wife can lay claim only to the common ancestors, not the wealth that some of these families possess to this day.

Anyway, concerning your tips:

- Thanks for Balnamoon/Bonnymoon, at least from the location it might be the Ballinamon mentioned in the birth brief. I'll see if I find anything about a Colles/Collace family nearby. [Edit: And there are indeed Collaces of Balnamoon, so we have a hit, too! Thanks for the help. ]
- Edzell is definitely a hit, thanks! From the name alone I wouldn't have guessed it. But I found a transcript of the "Publications of the Lindsay Society" where it says the following: "The Clan meeting in 1899 took place at Edzell — the old pronunciation of which was Egle or Aigle." A first look shows that finding the correct Lindsay of Edzell and Glenesk might be quite tough (or impossible) since there are a whole lot. But I'll dive into it deeper at a later point.

I'll also look into the other resources, thanks for the links! I'll look into them.

Burke's is indeed not really a help for me, since the more detailed records are more recent and the people that I have a definite source for are so far not important enough to be recorded in the less detailed records.

[smiddykilry]

Hello,
Just a quick note that there is a Lawton house and farm just to the north of Collace.https://ancientmonuments.uk/124320-macb ... tVfwXbMLAA



Smid

[WilmaM]

Hi Uli.
I'll post snippets as I find them,

Wikitree has this: https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Spalding-1215

George "in Milnhaugh" Spalding
Born about 1570 in Airlie, Angus, Scotlandmap
ANCESTORS ancestors
Son of George Spalding and Isabel (Ogilvy) Spalding
[sibling(s) unknown]
Husband of Helen (Ogilvy) Spalding — married about 1595 [location unknown]
DESCENDANTS descendants
Father of George Spalding, Andrew Spalding and John Johan Spalding
Died about 1635 at about age 65 in Milnhaugh, Alyth, Scotlandmap
George was born at Grange of Airlie about 1570, son to George Spalding of the Grange of Airlie by his wife Isabel Ogilvy.
George left Airlie and moved to the next parish of Alyth where he farmed MIlnhaugh.
When residing in Milnhaugh he was directed in a charter of 4 November 1600 by George Ramsay of Bamff to carry out the office of bailie to give sasine to Gilbert Ramsay and Isabel Ogilvy of the lands of Easter Mawes and others. About 1595 he married Helen Ogilvy daughter of the deceased William Ogilvy of Keillor.

They had three sons:
1. George who emigrated to Sweden where he was a merchant. Buried Oct 11th, 1667 in Norrkoping
2. Andrew who emigrated to Sweden and was a merchant in Mecklenburg. In 1636 he gifted a silver chalice to the kirk of Taby. He married about 1629 to Catherine Franck. who died 17 Oct 1678.
3. John born about 1600 also emigrated to Sweden and was a successful shipping merchant in Gothenburg. He married Joanna Kinnaird in Gothenberg on 12 Dec 1626.
George may have died about 1635. His son, Andrew, gifted a silver chalice to Toby Kirk in 1636.

Alyth is marked as Elith on the Roy map, There's a Millhaugh on the 1800's map [ Miln haugh in Scots would be a mill at the bend of a river] there are still old buildings there.

A lot of the names mentioned here will likely be mentioned in more detail on Scotlands Places or on Canmore https://canmore.org.uk/

edit:
here's another book with lots of names & places you may recognise from the details you already have;
https://electricscotland.com/history/fo ... hire02.pdf

Although the places you are interested in are in present day Angus region, it was known as Forfarshire in the past, and Kincardineshire and Perthshire border it closely so they will be relevant too.

[elgalleto]

Hello,

my wife is also a descendant of the Spalding family. Andreas Spalding from Milnhaugh is her 10x great grandfather.

First of all thanks to Uli for the clear preparation of the birth brief and thanks to everyone for the further information!

I have a question about this:

28, father of 15: domini baronis de Carnegie postea vero comitis de Southesk (the Baron of Carnegie, who later became the Earls of Southesk)

If Andreas was born in 1590 and each generation has a difference of at least 20 years, then this baron was born in 1510 or even earlier. For example, a Spalding ancestor of the same generation was born in 1460. However, the Earl of Southesk was awarded in 1633 - on David Carnegie, who was born in 1575. That doesn't match.

Is there an explanation? Is probably meant that the title (not the person) Baron of Carnegie became the Earl of Southesk?

Thank you for any idea!

regards from Germany
Andre